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Exhibit #5: The Younger Dryas and the "Mystery interval

 
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Andre



Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 298
Location: Germany - The Nederlands

PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:38 am    Post subject: Exhibit #5: The Younger Dryas and the "Mystery interval Reply with quote

Actually this thread is not about the Younger Dryas directly but we compare it with the interval of about 17,500 - 14,500 years ago.

The significance is clear when looking at the isotope anomaly between the poles, a "warming" South versus a "cooling" North, that is if we believe the isotopes:



Denton et al 2006 write:

Quote:
GH Denton, WS Broecker, RB Alley, 2006; The mystery interval 17.5 to 14.5 kyrs ago, Past Global Changes (Pages) Volume 14 No 2 August 2006, pp14-17

Abstract
The time period between the beginning of Heinrich event #1 (H-1) and the onset of the Bølling/Allerød rivals the Younger Dryas in importance to our understanding of how the planet responds to abrupt mode switches. This interval also constitutes the onset of the most recent termination, arguably the most fundamental climate shift of the last 100-kyr glacial cycle. As some of the responses during this time appear to be mutually contradictory, we term it the “Mystery Interval”.


Denton et al contend further in detail that

Quote:
...on a global scale the earth generally warmed during the mystery interval, including the Northern hemisphere, however with several contradictions. For instance extensive deglaciation of the European Alps occurred during a time of maximum cold in the adjacent Atlantic Ocean and Mediterranean Sea, along with some indications of continued cold conditions, at least during winter, on the continent itself. This conclusion comes from oxygen-isotope curves of carbonate from lakes and mires that allow European climate oscillations to be tied directly to the Greenland template (e.g., von Grafenstein et al., 1999). Such records from the Swiss Alps show that extensive glacier recession had already occurred prior to the distinctive earliest Bølling isotope switch, which was accompanied by a “juniper jump” in pollen profiles (Eicher and Siegenthaler, 1976). It is important to note from isotope chronologies that both Andean and New Zealand mountain glaciers abandoned their innermost Last Glacial Maximum (LGM) positions and also suffered extensive retreat during the Mystery Interval (Denton et al., 1999; Strelin and Denton, 2005; Schaefer et al., 2006).


I'll add the refs when so desired. Also I will show later that the low sea surface temps are debatable.

But see what the conflict is? isotopes are supposed to tell cooling but everything else tells warming. This is what compares the Mystery interval with the Younger Dryas.

But what do the isotopes in precipitation signify? Look at the extreme correlation between snow accumulation (top) and isotopes (middle) in the Greenland ice cores:



Suppose that we accept that isotopes are merely a powerful indicator of the rate of precipitation, in which any temperature signal is lost, wouldn't that solve the contradictions of the Mystery interval and the Younger Dryas?

Not that it solves what really happened of course, but at least we know what NOT happened, rapid extreme temperature changes within decades.

But if we loose the isotopes temperature signal we also loose the evidence for flickering climates:

http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/docs/2007/2007_Hansen_etal_2.pdf

Rapid climate changes certainly, but changes in humidity and precipation, while the temperature variation is obscured.

See also
The Younger Dryas exhibits
Exhibit #1, The Younger Dryas and the Meerfelder maar
Exhibit #2, The Younger Dryas and Mediterranean region
Exhibit #3, The Younger Dryas and South greenland
Exhibit #4, The Younger Dryas and Glaciation
Exhibit #5, The Younger Dryas and the Mystery interval
Exhibit #6, The Younger Dryas and North America
Exhibit #7, The start of the Younger Dryas
Exhibit #8, The Younger Dryas and the Siberian Steppes



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Last edited by Andre on Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total
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Andre



Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 298
Location: Germany - The Nederlands

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A bunch more about the Mystery interval, not mentioned by Denton et al. Since this period is not biased with massive glacial readvances, there is a chance that it is better acceptable that the Greenland Ice cores are not telling about the warming in that period.

Quote:
Davis et al (1975) investigates a pollen core from Moulton Pond, Maine, which deglaciated about 14,000 years (14C) ago (16,7 ka Cal BP)

Stone et al (1998) obtain Cosmogenic 36Cl ages for two samples from ice-scoured basalt outcrops of 17.6 ± 1.4 and 17.4 ± 1.3 cal. ka BP, at the The Storr, Isle of Skye, Scotland and provide minimal dates for the onset of ice-sheet thinning

A radiocarbon date of 13 870 ± 150 BP (c. 17.0–16.2 cal. ***ka BP) is maximal for ice-sheet deglaciation at Loch Ashik in eastern Skye (Walker et al., 1988; Walker and Lowe, 1990), Ballentyne et al 1998)

Vescovi et al 2007 reconstruct the vegetational history of the southern side of the Alps shows that Alpine deglaciation must have started before 18,000–17,500 cal yr BP south of the Alps

Clark (2003) examines evidence from alpine glacial deposits in the American Cordillera and observes glacial retreats In the Sierra Nevada, between 17,000 and ~15,000 14C yr BP(~20,100-18,500 cal yr B.P. and in the North Cascades by ~17,000 36Cl yr BP; in southern Idaho at 13ka BP (15,3 ka Cal BP).

Sandgren et al (1999) observe that sedimentation of Lake Kullatorpssjön in South Sweden started 14,660 14C years BP, recalibrated to 17,820 Cal BP years, denoting the time of deglaciation.

Andrews (2000) investigates the NE margin of the Laurentide Ice sheet in Canada and observes initial deglaciation at 14.5 ka or 17.5 ka Cal BP.

Kovanen and Easterbrook (2001) report rapid deglaciation in the North Cascades in Washington between 14 500 and 12 500 14C yr B.P (17.5 – 14.7 ka Cal BP)

Ager (2003) analyses the late Quaternary vegetation and climate history of the central Bering land bridge from St. Michael Island, western Alaska and infers a clear warming between 15 and 13 ka BP (ca 18.5 ka – 15.3 Ka Cal BP ).

Glover (2004) find carbon dates of 16500-15000 14C years BP for basin forming associated with glacial retreat, which calibrates to 19,700 – 18.,500 Cal years BP. Clastic to biologic sedimentation transition happened at 13,370 14C years, which calibrates to 15,900 cal years BP.

Hill et al 2006 find also indication early deglacial warmth 2 ka before the formal termination and remark that those findings "are consistent with a growing number of records from around the globe that exhibit pre-Bølling warming prior to Termination IA, and extends the record of such processes to the northern Pacific

Hubberten et al 2004 reconstruct Summer climate changes Laptev Sea area based on a fossil-insect record in the Mamontovy Khayata section, Bykovsky Peninsula (fig 6) and find a substantial summer climate improvement in two steps around 15 ka 14C yeasrs BP and 14 Ka 14C years BP, which calibrated to ~18,5 – 16,7 Ka Cal years BP

Shakun et al 2007 (Jemen) A gradual increase in moisture thereafter was interrupted by an abrupt drying event at 16.4 ka, perhaps related to Heinrich event 1.

Jacobi et al 2007 reconstruct precipitation variations in Northern Brazil for the last 20 ka deduced from biotic δD values, An abrupt change from arid towards much wetter conditions occurred from 17.3 to 16.8 k and coincides with a change from savannah to rainforest taxa. isotope data show only a small rise in aridity during Younger Dryas event (13–11.5 ka.

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scpg02



Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 221
Location: Sacramento

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
observes glacial retreats In the Sierra Nevada, between 17,000 and ~15,000 14C yr BP


Great pictures of the Sierra Nevada

Donner Lake

I've spent most of my life in these mountains. My dad was a forester and worked on both the Tahoe National and Lassen National.
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Andre



Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 298
Location: Germany - The Nederlands

PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lucky you. Smile

I live on a "mountain", currently, The "Heuberg", elevation 3150 ft. This is within a few miles distance:


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scpg02



Joined: 22 Jul 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Donner Pass

Donner Pass (el. 7,085 ft. / 2,160 m.) is a high mountain pass in the northern Sierra Nevada, located above Donner Lake about nine miles West of Truckee, California. It is a narrow pass with a very steep approach from the east, and a gradual approach from the west.

To reach Donner Pass from the East, pioneer emigrants to California had to travel across the Nevada desert, and this route was normally avoided in favor of the Santa Fe Trail.

In the winter of 1846–1847, the Donner Party was trapped by snowstorms, and members were forced to endure such great hunger that animal hides was the only nutritional sustenance available to the party. Of the 83 people who were trapped east of the Pass, only 45 survived to reach California, and some of them resorted to cannibalism to survive. [1]

In 1913, the Lincoln Highway, the first road across America, was routed over Donner Pass.

On January 13, 1952, another group became stranded about seventeen miles west of Donner pass at Yuba Pass on Track #2 adjacent to Tunnel 35 (Track #1) at about MP 176.5. Southern Pacific's passenger train "City of San Francisco" was en route westbound through the gap when a raging blizzard slowed the train to a halt. The passengers and crew were stranded for six days until help could arrive.

_________________________________________________________

Winter weather in Donner Pass can be brutal. Precipitation averages 54 inches (137 cm), most of which falls as snow. At 415 inches (10.5 m) per year, Donner Pass is one of the snowiest places in the United States. To take advantage of the heavy snows, the Boreal Ski Resort was built to the north. Ski resorts in the Lake Tahoe area report an average of 300 to 500 inches (7.6 to 12.7 meters) of snowfall per season.[3] Winds in the pass can also become extreme and 100+ mph (160 km/h) wind gusts are common during winter storms. Winter temperatures in the area drop below zero several times each year; the all-time record low for California of -45°F was recorded at the Boca Reservoir (east of Truckee) in January 1937.

The winter of 1846-47 was especially severe, and this is generally cited as the single most important factor in the disaster of the Donner Party.

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I grew up in Susanville and Grass Valley.
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scpg02



Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 221
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andre wrote:

I live on a "mountain", currently, The "Heuberg", elevation 3150 ft.


Grass Valley were I used to live is at roughly 3000'. It is considered a foothill community. My folks still live there.


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